tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post3353019466215762959..comments2023-12-31T01:23:39.943-05:00Comments on Mayerson on Animation: More on BrandoMark Mayersonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00065971589878678848noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-37458739085384314422007-05-08T19:59:00.000-04:002007-05-08T19:59:00.000-04:00I don't claim to be any kind of expert on anime, s...I don't claim to be any kind of expert on anime, so if I'm out of line here, call me on it. But I think that Japanese animation may fulfill the writing side of creating great performances, but they fail at the performances themselves. By contrast, American animation consistently fails on the writing side but is good at the performance side. If we could combine the best of both, we'd really have something.Mark Mayersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00065971589878678848noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-60973098703645686072007-05-08T19:42:00.000-04:002007-05-08T19:42:00.000-04:00Honestly I don't know of an animated scene that wo...Honestly I don't know of an animated scene that would have the same resonance, but you're more likely to have something like that happen in a Japanese market. <BR/><BR/>Films that come to mind are:<BR/><BR/>Perfect Blue - Satoshi Kon<BR/>Tokyo Godfathers - Satoshi Kon<BR/>Ghost in the Shell<BR/>Neon Genisis Evangeleon <BR/>Cowboy Bebop<BR/><BR/>I don't know specifics, it'll take a little research, but the sensibility for such a scene seems to be more present.<BR/><BR/>Out of all the American animation to come out, Brad Bird's films also have that potential. For the kid markets Incredibles and Iron Giant also have the potential for that level of exposition.B_Steelohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13040971809616994814noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-45044519643436311592007-05-08T12:21:00.000-04:002007-05-08T12:21:00.000-04:00Also, while the market here is relatively untested...<I>Also, while the market here is relatively untested, animation from everywhere outside of North America (Europe, Asia) is doing animation catering to all sorts of age demographics.</I><BR/><BR/>...just wanted to correct that. Most Asian animation are still pretty kiddy-oriented. You might want to say Japan instead. I was interning back home and most of our producer thinks its the kids stuff that sells. And China is still looking to producing kiddy cartoons as well. Aside from Wonderful Days, the Koreans seem to stick with kiddy stuff as well.S. Stephani Soejonohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06736543686467812023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-68573428546052535912007-05-08T02:13:00.000-04:002007-05-08T02:13:00.000-04:00One major thing to think about is style and conten...One major thing to think about is style and content. Animation can create fantasy beyond our wildest dreams. However, does that mean that we shoul shy away from telling realistic stories? I read back in the day in the field of comics, there were much more genres in the mainstream eye. Romance, Western, Crime, Horror. Animation can tell any type of story wiether it's realistic or fantasty like. What is important is that we utilize the techniques of animation to provide a visual stimmulus/experience to tell stories that live action cannot.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-86565233486234906462007-05-05T09:15:00.000-04:002007-05-05T09:15:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Alihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12200158738230958775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-87787868821680891642007-05-04T20:51:00.000-04:002007-05-04T20:51:00.000-04:00hey pete,actually, gollum was heavily influenced b...hey pete,<BR/><BR/>actually, gollum was heavily influenced by the animators who worked on him. Andy was used for reference for a lot of the work, but there was just as much which was developed and performed straight from the animator's hands.jasonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07974113731468024126noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-26058668940706260762007-05-04T15:07:00.000-04:002007-05-04T15:07:00.000-04:00You don't have to be a great actor to do a believa...You don't have to be a great actor to do a believable performance. You have to be a great actor to deliver a great, unique performance.<BR/><BR/>And I completely agree that our medium can support any type of film. Of course, you shouldn't do animation that could almost be rotoscope of a scene like this one with Brando. You should USE caricature etc to make these types of acting choices work in animation. It would be tough, and it would require a lot of skill and thought, but is it impossible or undesirable? I don't think so.Benjamin De Schrijverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04113326323094548928noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-90418071123480186642007-05-03T21:16:00.000-04:002007-05-03T21:16:00.000-04:00Brad Bird has long complained about this phenomeno...Brad Bird has long complained about this phenomenon. And anyone arguing against an adult market for animation need only look at the audiences of animated television shows such as Family Guy and the Simpsons. This is definitely an older demographic than Saturday morning cartoons. Also, while the market here is relatively untested, animation from everywhere outside of North America (Europe, Asia) is doing animation catering to all sorts of age demographics.<BR/><BR/>Again, this seems to be mainly gatekeepers thinking that the market is too risky to even test out the waters. If a big budget, more adult themed, animated film was released in as wide a release as Ratatouille is getting, with as good of a marketing campaign, would it really flop? I guess we probably won't find out anytime soon.<BR/><BR/>Pete talks about exaggerated movement and caricature being not only a staple, but a requirement of good animation. I also believe this to be true but I think that we can still have challenging, moral, ethical, and even religious dilemmas going on in the characters - this is a story problem, not so much an acting problem. I think the medium can definitely support this kind of story, I guess it only comes down to whether or not someone is brave enough to gamble with this in the North American market.<BR/><BR/>I guess this topic also raises the dilemma of whether or not an animated performance/actor is as good as a live action actor. There are definitely differences, but is a good animated performance of the Milt Kahls and the Frank Thomases any less believable than the Marlon Brandos and the Laurence Oliviers? I for one never stopped believing that Sher Khan was a in fact, a tiger, not a moving drawing with calculated strobing lines. I felt it was simply a living, moving being capable of thought, action, and reaction. I definitely don't think that there's been any acting opportunities in animation that challenges a character morally like we see in live action, but right back to my former argument, I don't think I've seen the range of animated film like we see in live action. Both of them are mediums, and I think they can both do the same things - just that animation is freer to do anything that a person can imagine.<BR/><BR/>My (long) two cents.Cookedarthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16516071831717511595noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-49520567397302805802007-05-03T21:00:00.000-04:002007-05-03T21:00:00.000-04:00At the risk of sounding like I'm playing devil's a...At the risk of sounding like I'm playing devil's advocate here, Mark, I think that Gollum may be an unfortunate example. Remember, you've already questioned not long ago whether Mo-Cap characters really qualify as animation. While technically they may, the animator's role is pretty much limited to that of make-up artist, with the performance being largely controlled by the actor.<BR/><BR/>Yes, Gollum is a conflicted character and Andy Sirkis infuses his performance with much emotional turmoil to show his good vs. evil personalities fighting for control within him. How much of that performance is contributed by the animator? Frankly, I don't really know, but I would guess that it is minimal.<BR/><BR/>Are there conflicted characters in the animated features? I would argue yes, but they are painted with broader strokes. Sebastian ultimately decides to help Ariel achieve her dream of remaining human, though it goes completely against his better judgement and means he will have to answer for his actions and face the wrath of King Triton. Jiminy Cricket and Bagheera are similarly conflicted in their respective films. Again, I'm not suggesting the acting is on a par with Brando's Terry in "On the Waterfront", but quite honestly, do you really believe that would be possible or even desirable in an animated feature? I remain dubious.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27501132.post-45461301116013185342007-05-03T20:57:00.000-04:002007-05-03T20:57:00.000-04:00Wonderful Wonderful post.Wonderful Wonderful post.Benjamin De Schrijverhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04113326323094548928noreply@blogger.com